Purchase of Batteries

In the german forums (vectric-forum.de or twizy-online.de) there has been some discussion about buying the battery. As Renault/RCI doesn’t offer this possibility, some forum member has contacted Kreisel (a firm that specialises in conversions, and for example offers a VW Caddy with 350km range).

After some mails, they have made a firm offer. If they get 10 purchasers, they will develop a 13kWh battery, including BMS and weighting about 70kg (original Twizy has 6.1 usable or 7kWh total, in 100kg). The price would be 6900 Eur, I think before taxes. It would come with warranty; the battery will keep above 80% of it’s original capacity for at least 180000km.

There is also a second option. Another forum member, which already has developed and used a range extender and added extra chargers to his Twizy, has revealed that at his company they are also developing a new battery. Probably they will let you choose a capacity (12 or 17kWh) and they will also offer a new charger that can charge with 3 or 6kW instead of the 2.2kW that the original charger does. A type 2 plug (Mennekes) would be an option, too. Price is unknow for now, but it is expected to be somewhat cheaper than the Kreisel one.

I would rather prefer a smaller one, more similar to the original Twizy one, so about 50-60% of what they offer if that would mean also a similar reduction in price. The range is not a problem for me right now, and the extra price is a bit hard to justify. Renault’s battery is enough for me, but they are not selling it and the leasing contract is unacceptable.

This sounds a lot more promising. Keep us informed if you find out more.

I still need to be able to charge at 2.2KW (10 amps) but would be happy if it could be variable depending on what it was connect to.

You are right £5000 + possible Vat is a lot of money but double the range is why it is double the price. At least it is nothing to do with RCI.

I have still not signed and returned the agreement 14 pages is a lot of contract it seems that RCI want to cover every angle so its not there fault or problem I would have preferred to buy a battery and go with the warranty. I would prefer a greater range something like 80 miles would be good, we can dream eh

Peter

With the above batteries you could most probably have a range of ~80 miles. With the Renault one I consistently made 70km (41mi) or more in the city and around 55km (32mi) when at max speed. With double the battery I think you would get more than double the range, because on top of the double capacity you have to add that the discharge rate in C is smaller, and normally this means that more energy can be extracted from the battery. The higher the discharge rate the smaller the total energy it can provide, or the smaller the discharge rate, the more energy you can extract. Also they say it will be a little lighter than the original one, but probably the impact of this in the range will be negligible.

For my usecase they are too expensive. I don’t really need the extended range on a daily basis. To pay £2500 extra, just to have a bigger “reserve tank” that I won’t use doesn’t make much sense to me. But if you really need it, then it’s fantastic indeed.

Yes I did something similar in my boat which is off grid whilst 750 ah of full traction sufficed just, the 1500 ah I have allows me 2-3 days of poor sunshine with ease and no thought of charging by either running the engine or the generator.
Lets see where this supplier goes you never know in a few years they might be cheaper than RCI

Peter

Sounds interesting, probably those aftermarket ones would have a longer lifetime too. (Bigger capacity) Since lithium batteries can last a lot of cycles (5-800 cycles for lithium polymer ones, and over a thousand for LiFe batteries). If you use it well - and never ever get it under 20% charge. Every time you do, it’s harmful to the battery and should especially not leave it under 20%. So a bigger battery would be easier to keep over 20% With my lithium ion batteries I see at least 2-5 times the lifetime when using them and always being over 20%. My phone battery has not degraded a bit on 2 years with that treatment. So charge your Twizys as often as you can (to keep it over 20%). Lithium doesn’t have the “memory feature” that Pb or NiMh battery’s do :smile: The future in batteries is LiFe.

Edit. US military have tested LiFe with 7000 cycles without losing more than 15% total capacity. On a battery with 80 mile range that’s almost 90000 km